Totallyamaha TLS vs.
Trail Grabbers

®

TLS vs. Trail Grabbers

www.rx1.info/viewtopic.php?t=2481

RX-1snow – Dec 30, 2003 7:12pm

Has anyone tried the studs that screw directly into the tip of the lug? I have a 1.25 inch lug. Just wondering if there might be trouble with this and if not, are they very effective? Thanks

redeye23 – Dec 30, 2003 8:30pm

I have 250 of the bergstrom carbide tip screws on my 03 shorty. I put them on with about 300 miles on my sled last year and it was a night and day difference when I hit the ice and groomed trails. I now have almost 4,000 miles on my sled and not one of them has ripped or fallen out and I have not lost one lug (screwed or unscrewed) on the POS stock track I still have on. When I installed them I put super glue on each one then drilled them in with just a 5/16" drill bit. It took me a couple of hours and I didn't have to remove the track to do it. I also have no damage to my heat shield.

I planned on replacing the track when it wore out but the problem is it still looks new. I rode 3500 miles in VT, ME, Quebec and CT last year and these screws were very effective on the groomed trails and ice that I mainly ride. It is in fresh snow that I wish I had a rip saw because the screws don't help you and the stock 03 track really sucks in fresh un-groomed snow.

Waterboy – Dec 30, 2003 10:03pm

Used them on a 2002 Polaris 700 Edge M-10 that I still have. They peeled the lugs off the track. Went to remove remaining screws to try and fudge a warranty claim but there was only 6 left.

Do have to admit that I exceeded the recommended track minimum thickness. Polaris 1.00 lug is actually just over .900.

Probably had 4,000 miles on the track.

I still might try on the Warrior ripsaw which is full 1.25 just for the weight saving feature. I would keep a very close eye on track this time.

Studding a 1.25 with ¼ stickout is pushing the limits on track loading as well as clearance. (stickout for Trail Grabbers is ¼" while the TLS stickout is 3/8")

Broken Arrow – Dec 31, 2003 4.09am

I have used the Bergstrom Trail Grabbers on my 1 ¼" Track with good results. You have to make sure you use enough – About 250 to 300 should be good for a stock RX-1. Like redeye23 said – use super glue on the threads when installing them. The Trail Grabbers are not for everybody. It depends on the type of riding you do. Some riders require regular studs for the kind of riding/racing they do. – I was skeptical last year but after looking at the Bergstrom web-site and talking to the owner on the phone I was convinced – the owner – I think his name was Scott, was very helpful. He talked to me for over a half hour. I ended up buying a pair of skegs but haven't had a chance to use them yet. They are supposed to last much longer than the Saber Skegs that I have been using. Check out Bergstrom web-site…It is full of all kinds of good information.

Vmaxjohn – Dec 31, 2003 5:43pm

Waterboy, I'm curious about which ones you used. There were two companies selling a screw in lug stud with a carbide tip, like a traditional stud. The first time I looked at them, I knew they'd be nothing but problems since they would penetrate the ice, and make way too much traction! If you used those, I would not be surprised at your results.

I just want to make sure we're talking apples to apples.

Waterboy – Dec 31, 2003 8:22pm

Not sure of the make. Purchased from Sled Pro Distribution here in Canada. He probably re-packaged them under his label. There was only one length available at that time and I know that the penetration was into the track cords on the Polaris OEM track. This was probably part of the problem. It may have restricted the lug flex. They did look to be of good quality.

I ride in good trail conditions in mainly in North Western Quebec so they are well suited to the small amount of hard pack I see.

I have never ridden without studs prior to this years warrior and as yet I have not decided which way I will go.

Vmaxjohn – Dec 31, 2003 10:50pm

Waterboy, it sounds like another brand. To my knowledge, Bergstrom sells only under his name and ships where ever you want.

Describe what the heads looked like, might help. Thanks.

Waterboy – Jan 05, 2004 3:13pm

Heat treated hex-head screw with a carbide insert that was silver soldered to head. Stick-out was 3/8". If I remember correctly the nut driver I used was 5/16".

The screw thread lead was not a standard metal screw pitch but courser much like a specialty plastic pitch screw.

Vmaxjohn – Jan 06, 2004 1:55am

Yeah, those sound like the ones Bottom Line was distributing. Another company developed them, and a few places sold them in the US.

If they are what I think, they had a smallish chunk of carbide that looked like a regular stud, just smaller. This is where the design was flawed I feel, since any penetration into a hard surface would over tax the lug.

With the Bergstrom TG's, it's a bunch of chips brazed onto the head, so there is no penetration, just scratching.

Rx1mtn – Jan 06, 2004 1:03pm

I have the Bergstrom in my 02 Viper, I put 1 in every lug. 3000 miles and not 1 has come out. I'm not aggressive but I do ride somewhat hard at times and I like to race when the opportunity comes along.